Forum Activity for @Chocoflyer

Chocoflyer
@Chocoflyer
03/17/08 14:28:49
71 posts

My Top Ten places to buy choc in NYC (but there are so many more...)


Posted in: Opinion

Richart is quite an established french co., 20+ years old, they are well known for small square pieced with both exquisite and unusual flavors & artwork on them- really quite impressive! and expensive...but worth it. Their shops look so much like art galleries thath many ppl dont realize they are choc shops! I think there are 2 in nYC, sorry dont have adress this moment...Payard is a very beautiful cafe inside with dark mahogany type wood decor and a choc counter on one side, choc & coffee drinks on the other side and I think serves cafe food also. They have been shown on shows like Cashmere Mafia and cater to a ritzy crowd, upper east side, but their chocolates are surprisingly "affordable" compared to many others in NYC- i got quite a few for $10. they were really delicious too. Highly recommended.
Brady
@Brady
03/08/08 20:42:16
42 posts

My Top Ten places to buy choc in NYC (but there are so many more...)


Posted in: Opinion

It's fun to make lists. Here's my picks.1. The Chocolate Room (Brooklyn)- 2nd best selection for bars and a nice cafe2. The Chocolate Shop at the Food Emporium (68th and 3rd Ave.)- largest selection for bars in NYC(Amedei, Pralus, Felchlin, Domori, not bad)3. Pierre Marcolini (UES)- only interested in the bars4a. Jacque Torres (King St. and Hudson)- my favorite hot chocolate and favorite cafe. 4b.(Brooklyn) feels like Europe5. Michel Cluizel(Union Sq)- Cluizel bars are great, also my favorite place for Clay's meetups6. Brooklyn Ice Cream Factory- the chocolate fudge is sweet but great on ice cream7. Kee's- my favorite fresh truffles8.Grom (UWS)- named origin chocolate gelato, they also use Valrhona9. Cocoa Bar (Brooklyn)- I love the atmosphere and the patio out back.10. Christopher Norman- for the feeling of being lost in the Financial District and finding these beautifully painted truffles
Sera
@Sera
03/03/08 21:41:43
39 posts

My Top Ten places to buy choc in NYC (but there are so many more...)


Posted in: Opinion

Lovely list! Thanks for pointing it out.Never heard of #4 and #7, mind providing more info? :)
Chocoflyer
@Chocoflyer
02/08/08 15:27:04
71 posts

My Top Ten places to buy choc in NYC (but there are so many more...)


Posted in: Opinion

1- Jaques Torres Chocolate Haven- a temple of fine choc with factory on site2- Michael Cluizel- stunning shop, delicious and fair priced3- La Maison du Chocolat- a French classic that never goes out of style4- Richart- like shopping at an art gallery5- Scharffen Berger- adorable closet size shop, classy6- Dean & Deluca- incredible selection, always a surprise in store7- Payard - elegant yet very affordable pieces and pastries8- Max Brenner Cafe- how to have FUN with chocolate!9- Kee's- very unique, special, smallest shop ever10- Vosges- gorgeous as well as delicious and daring
updated by @Chocoflyer: 04/18/15 04:29:44
Clay Gordon
@Clay Gordon
02/07/08 16:30:13
1,689 posts

Lab Tests Reveal More Than Just Sweets in Candy


Posted in: News & New Product Press (Read-Only)

A report from the Dallas CBS affiliate that talks about things that are found in chocolate. Found are things that are allowed by the FDA but might surprise you. Most interesting is that the report names names. Who gets exposed? That might surprise you, too.(NOTE: The video is embedded in a page at Yahoo! that contains a video ad preceding the report.)
updated by @Clay Gordon: 12/13/24 12:16:07
Chocoflyer
@Chocoflyer
02/07/08 19:40:20
71 posts

Charlemagne's Plain, Green Tea and Cinnamon Bars


Posted in: Tasting Notes

Sera- you are quite eloquent with your descriptions, thanx for all the details and photo too. I look forward to trying this chocolate, espec the Belize and Cinnamon bars. When i do I will compare/contrast w/ your great tasting notes...
Sera
@Sera
02/06/08 21:30:40
39 posts

Charlemagne's Plain, Green Tea and Cinnamon Bars


Posted in: Tasting Notes

Here's the tasting notes for the organic Charlemagne bars I bought last week. Charlemagne Plain Belize: (red wrapper): 84% solids. The design is sl sleek, with the bar being very long and slim. The cardboard opens to reveal a tightly sealed plastic wrapper in a rich shimmery brown color. The bar is one solid block ,about 1/4 inch thick and has minimal designs on the top. Not even blocks to indicate how much you should eat. The smell itself is very bitter, strong notes of coffee, pine trees and wood. overall it it gives me a very "wet" impression. The snap was strong, but I noticed some small bubble holes in the break, which was otherwise clean. In the mouth, the flavor is very subdued and first and lightly sweet. I got notes of cocoa, caramel and a little vanilla. I kept expecting the flavor to grow and change into something more bitter as the aroma indicated, but instead the flavors just grew in intensity. The wetness gets stronger, the cocoa dominates with the caramel and vanilla becoming supporting cast. The mouthfeel is extremely smooth and rich. Once the flavors quickly hit their apex, they stay steadfast and unchanging until they lightly peter out in the finish, with very light notes of vanilla and sugar. It reminds of the flavor you are left with after drinking an excellent mug of hot chocolate. I was surprised with no bitterness, sourness or tannic qualities and am impressed with the lovely flavors expressed in this bar. I'll definitely be buying this one again. My favorite of the bunch. Green Tea (green wrapper): 74% solids. Same gorgeous packaging. The chocolate itself looks a tad darker in color, but has the same simple design on the top side. The smell to this is very exotic. It's very much like green tea with bright fresh grassy notes, but also has a big floral quality to it that I typically do not associate with green tea. It smells more like jasmine green to me. The snap is soft despite the 74% mass, but the break is extremely clean. The dark chocolate has a wonderful mild cocoa flavor with notes of cream, tart red berries and citrus. The flavor waits a few moments before releasing the berry and citrus flavors, which gives it a subtle sour quality and leaves a slightly dry and pleasantly clean finish, with a note of the berries but no tartness. The main flavor of the chocolate is the tea, which, doesn't taste of green at all. The grassy notes in the aroma are gone and I get a very intense floral jasmine tea flavor to it which is exotic and brings out a pear-like fruitiness in the chocolate as the notes of the tea linger on the palate. This bar is delightful since there's a lot going on and it gives you the time to play and notice all the different nuances that are going on. "After Dinner" Dark chocolate with a subtle cinnamon flavor (blue wrapper): 74% mass. This bar look a little darker in color than the other two, with blue undertones in the brown. The snap is much sharper as well, and the break is clean. The aroma is a little sour, I smell red fruits, coffee and tobacco. No hint of cinnamon. Once in the mouth it has a beautiful melt. The chocolate feels nice and cool on the tongue. The flavor is of buttery cocoa at first with notes of pine. I then notice the cinnamon, but it's very subtle, and it adds a woody accent to the chocolate as opposed to a spicy one like I'm used to and have come to expect. I taste no hints of the red fruits that I smelled, but toward the end of the flavor ride I get subtle sour notes of grapefruit and citrus, lime perhaps? The finish is clean and disappears quickly on the tongue leaving a slightly dry note. I was surprised by the woodsyness in this bar and although it was nice chocolate, I didn't enjoy it as much as the others.Please share your notes if you've tasted these. I'm curious to see how they compare! :)
updated by @Sera: 04/21/15 13:14:40
Bethany Thouin
@Bethany Thouin
03/10/08 15:22:03
5 posts

What does "Master Chocolatier" mean anyway?


Posted in: Opinion

There is probably no correct answer for this one. I do know, that it should not be a self proclaimed title. None of the master chocolatiers that I know would dare to refer to themselves as such, but they would be humbled and honored to be introduced or referred to as one.A master chocolatier doesn't need a title to be recognized. It is something that is known through his/her achievements. So, he/she would be referred to as a master chocolatier by his/her peers, by the press or when being introduced.
Chocoflyer
@Chocoflyer
02/08/08 15:01:49
71 posts

What does "Master Chocolatier" mean anyway?


Posted in: Opinion

Maybe its like Master of your Domain- being the kitchen or choc shop in this case. Or its the title for anyone with any type of formal education on chocolate making- who has then taken that training and now produces a product of their own, so they are the Master Chocolatier of that business (like Head Chef). I wonder what those under them are called - sous chocolatiers? ha ha
Clay Gordon
@Clay Gordon
02/06/08 08:28:53
1,689 posts

What does "Master Chocolatier" mean anyway?


Posted in: Opinion

I think the confusion may be one of transliteration, not translation. Instead of focusing on the literal meaning of maitre (master), let's focus on it colloquially and conventionally.From Wikipedia:The *matre d'* (short for /*matre d'htel,*/ literally "master of the hall")In this sense, the maitre chocolatier is the master of the chocolate shop, not literally a master of the craft. This is especially likely in France, where they reserve MOF (Meilleur Ouvrier de France - or more literally master of the ouevre - style or subject ) for masters of a craft such as chocolate. They have MOFs in just about everything. Chocolate is a separate discipline from pastry, and there are woodworking MOFs, MOFs in working with glass, etc.Of course, I could be totally wrong about this. Etymology is a very interesting subject and false cognates abound. If you know better, I want to learn from you.
Sandra Andrews-Strasko
@Sandra Andrews-Strasko
02/06/08 08:22:44
8 posts

What does "Master Chocolatier" mean anyway?


Posted in: Opinion

This term, as well as "maitre chocolatier" are floating all around the chocolate world, but my research hasn't turned up any authoritative entity that gives this title. It seems like people are pretty much free to confer it upon themselves. I wonder how much meaning it really has.
updated by @Sandra Andrews-Strasko: 04/14/15 10:06:11
Valerie
@Valerie
02/11/08 19:16:30
29 posts

Is Cheap Name Brand Chocolate a Good Thing?


Posted in: Opinion

I think this is a common mistake that many higher end brands take in an effort to drive more sales. And most of the time it results in the dilution of its brand along with a broader move to becoming more common at the expense of diluting its premium price tag. In my opinion place (i.e. where the item is sold) is one of the most important differentiators a higher end brand, like Neuhaus has. Visiting a boutique store to find your favorite chocolate brands is part of the fun. If Neuhaus feels it needs a broader distribution channel it should look at alternatives that are more aligned with the Neuhaus image, I'm thinking Whole Foods would be a better compromise.
Clay Gordon
@Clay Gordon
02/05/08 20:39:05
1,689 posts

Is Cheap Name Brand Chocolate a Good Thing?


Posted in: Opinion

I was in one of my local Costcos (I am "blessed" to live near two) on the Tuesday before Thanksgiving and I wandered down an aisle I normally don't and saw not only packages of Hershey Cacao Reserve tasting squares but also boxes of Neuhaus chocolates.I did a double-take. Neuhaus. At CostCo. And I wondered ... "What is this world coming to that an upmarket Belgian brand with a retail presence of its own would start selling chocolate under its own name at Costco?"This is dangerous territory I think. Sure, the company get additional sales by selling to an audience that would normally not visit its stores because of the perception that the product cost too much. On the other hand, why would anyone go and spend top dollar in the retail boutique if they can buy the same product at Costco?The answer might be that they are not buying the same product - that what they're buying at Costco is not the same quality as what's available at the boutique.But what's the damage to the brand? Neuhaus is one of the oldest Belgian chocolate and founder Jean Neuhaus is credited with both the invention of the shell-molded truffle and the ballotin box.Is Neuhaus in Costco a good thing? For consumers? For Neuhaus?
updated by @Clay Gordon: 04/09/15 20:53:36
Sera
@Sera
05/19/08 09:44:50
39 posts

Bodum Chocolate Jug


Posted in: Tech Help, Tips, Tricks, Techniques

That's AWESOME! What a great gift idea! Where did you buy them, just curious? I got mine from mexgrocer.com.
Teresa
@Teresa
05/19/08 07:15:02
3 posts

Bodum Chocolate Jug


Posted in: Tech Help, Tips, Tricks, Techniques

I love molinillos! As an anthropologist, I've recently taken to giving them as gifts to chocoholic friends with a little story about how they're probably the first hot chocolate tool invented.By the way, Lorna, I did invest in the frother, which has been great. Thanks!
Sera
@Sera
05/18/08 21:03:36
39 posts

Bodum Chocolate Jug


Posted in: Tech Help, Tips, Tricks, Techniques

I've been using a molinillo for frothy hot chocolate. A uni-tasker, yes, but it's very pretty. I guess I'm just old fashioned. ;)
Lorna
@Lorna
02/11/08 21:17:03
15 posts

Bodum Chocolate Jug


Posted in: Tech Help, Tips, Tricks, Techniques

Yes, get one! They are great for all kinds of things a real multi-tasker. Anytime you need to do some fancy whisking, especially salad dressings. Just be sure to rinse it immediately so the fine spaces don't get all cruddy.
Teresa
@Teresa
02/11/08 21:10:12
3 posts

Bodum Chocolate Jug


Posted in: Tech Help, Tips, Tricks, Techniques

Ah, I've been thinking about getting one of those. Turns out Williams-Sonoma is home-based in Memphis, and they had them cheap at the outlet the other day but I managed to resist. Sounds like it's worth the $10. Should I pick one up? By the way, good work resisting the unitasker!
Lorna
@Lorna
02/11/08 20:50:21
15 posts

Bodum Chocolate Jug


Posted in: Tech Help, Tips, Tricks, Techniques

We ogled this for a few minutes at Target one day. Decided it was a cross between a Mexican chocolate whisk and a french press. In true Alton Brown form, we set the unitasker back on the shelf. We use the electric whisk I got in Germany like this http://www.1ofakindstuff.com/Amazing-Cappuccino-Whisk.html . In fact, Curt just picked up another in Singapore (irresistible electronics, I suppose). Want one?
Teresa
@Teresa
02/05/08 15:12:55
3 posts

Bodum Chocolate Jug


Posted in: Tech Help, Tips, Tricks, Techniques

Has anyone tested this little gadget yet?

The word from the manufacturer is:The manual blender of the jug mixes the chocolate powder and milk in a smooth way producing an uncongested froth without too much squirting. The cleverly devised manual blender consists of a propeller attached to a spiral rod making it a fun-to-use tool and ensuring the best mixed chocolate milk - the "sinful temptation" par exellence! The jug turns into a multi-purpose object as soon as the lid is removed, carrying any liquid from milk to lemonade to water. http://www.bodumusa.com/shop/line.asp?MD=1&GID=83&LID=553&CHK=&SLT=&mscssid=HFD3VT08M35C9JB2HM0AMNMUP64A5F76
updated by @Teresa: 04/11/25 09:27:36
Clay Gordon
@Clay Gordon
02/04/08 09:56:41
1,689 posts

Review of Charles Chocolates


Posted in: Tasting Notes

Intro Charles Chocolates founder Chuck Siegel is not new to the chocolate business. In fact, he started his first chocolate business some 20 years ago in the San Francisco Bay area. That business, Attivo Confections, is credited with the creation of the giant chocolate and caramel covered apple and first gourmet s'more, among other reinterpretations of childhood favorites.In starting Charles Chocolates, Chuck moved away from Attivo's focus and become a prestige artisan confectioner and chocolatier. All Charles Chocolates products are made in small batches using quality ingredients. Importantly, production focuses on freshness and the company strives to ship all products within three days of their date of manufacture.I received a large box of Charles Chocolates products seemingly one of almost everything in the catalog. It took quite a while to work my way trough them all even sharing them with colleagues family members and friends. Ingredients Product literature claims that no artificial ingredients or preservatives are used to make any of Charles Chocolates' products and a close look at the ingredients labels supports this.I did notice one incorrect ingredient label. The Teance Tea Collection label omits any mention of chocolate (chocolate liquor, cocoa mass, cocoa liquor, or cocoa beans) in the list of ingredients for the milk chocolate. I am sure that this is an oversight and is easily corrected as the ingredients are on a separate sticky label. Presentation The visual design of much of the packaging is slightly 50s retro making it familiar rather than aggressively modern. A wide variety of transfer designs is used with the most interesting of those being their edible chocolate boxes the boxes the chocolates come in is made of chocolate and decorated with a huge transfer on the top.

The seasonality of the edible chocolate boxes is reflected in the transfer designs.In some cases, the attention to detail lavished on the pieces themselves is not reflected in the packaging and does not live up to the brand image or the price of the product. A case in point is the back of the Teance box ($30 for 8oz (20 pieces), $60/lb).In particular, the labels on this box do not share a common design identity, and the best-by and ingredients labels are clearly afterthoughts and are not in keeping with the image of a prestige chocolatier.

Fit and Finish The major disappointment with respect to fit and finish of any of Charles Chocolates products was the pates des fruits . Normally, fruit jellies like this are covered in a layer of sugar crystals and I suppose at some point these jellies might have had one. However, the two boxes I got did not appear to have them and the jellies left unappetizing sticky smudge marks all over the tops and bottoms of the boxes. Also, the jellies did not actually fill the boxes a stock box was used and filled as much as possible rather than picking a box more suited in size to the amount of product being packed. At $16 for a 9oz box (or about $45/lb) and in the context of the overall brand image, I was disappointed.One aspect of the positioning of the tasting guide on the Teance box was also challenging I found looking at the list a clumsy procedure when the top of the box was off. I needed to lift it over my head to look at it without spilling the pieces all over. I suppose I could have put the top back on but I would have had do that each time or take all the pieces out of the box first.Overall on the enrobed pieces, the sides were of uniform thickness and fairly thin. However, sometimes the bottoms were not evenly coated. Aroma, Taste, and Texture Upon opening up any box (of chocolates) the primary sense impression was chocolate, a very good sign of a quality product. In some cases, and especially in the Teance Tea Collection, it was possible to distinguish that the centers in the pieces were flavored using different teas simply by smelling them even before they were opened.Ganaches were uniformly creamy and clean, as were the caramels, with most flavors easily identifiable (the least easy to differentiate were, in my opinion, the pates des fruits which as a group were the least well balanced flavors of the entire collection). The Jasmine tea was a standout with the bitter tannins of the tea quite evident on the tongue making for a complex flavor profile that, in the end, did not overpower the chocolate.From a texture perspective, the least appealing pieces were the panned almonds and hazelnuts whose coating was too thick and crunchy for the nuts within. Price Almost everything Charles Chocolates sells (except for the chocolate bars) is priced well above $40/pound with some items costing as much as $80/lb. This puts the company squarely in the Prestige category with a small proportion of items in the Premium category ($15-25/lb) and a few items in the Super Premium ($65+/lb) category. Conclusion One thing that would go a long way toward making getting or gifting Charles Chocolates would be a consistent approach to identifying what you're actually going to be eating. The Teance Tea Collection has a visual guide on the bottom of the box. The regular assortments do not have these guides whether in cardboard or edible chocolate boxes. There is a list of flavors on the bottom of the boxes of the pates des fruits but we are supposed to figure out for ourselves that the flavors are listed in the order that the pieces are packed in the box. To be fair, there is a downloadable tasting guide but I don't know how many people will think to stop what they are eating, go to the site to find the tasting guide, view it and/or print it, before going back to partaking.In the end, that's really a small criticism and Charles Chocolates is a welcome addition to the growing collection of high-end SF-area chocolatiers that includes Michael Recchiuti, XOX, Richard Donnelley, and others. Rating Categories :Premium, Prestige, Super-Premium Style :Belgian-influenced Rating :Good to Very Good Company Info Charles Chocolates Factory Store & Chocolate Bar6529 Hollis StreetEmeryville, CA 94608phone: 510.652.4412toll-free phone number: 888.652.4412fax: 510.652.4414Open daily 11am - 7 pm www.charleschocolates.com General Information:info@charleschocolates.comRetail Store:store@charleschocolates.comOccasions and Corporate Gifts:corporate@charleschocolates.comWholesale Inquiries:wholesale@charleschocolates.comTours and Special Events:events@charleschocolates.com
updated by @Clay Gordon: 04/29/15 03:55:39
Chocoflyer
@Chocoflyer
02/09/08 16:19:01
71 posts

Godiva Chocolate room- AKA "shameless Valentines promotions"


Posted in: News & New Product Press (Read-Only)

Another new Valentine promo comes from Michel Cluizel Dessert room in NYC- they are offering a special dessert for 2 with an acclaimed pastry chef and a box of Cluizel chocs to take home.....more details at the website Im sure (i got it as an email promo). Man I wish i could afford to live in NYC! Its all happening there!
Chocoflyer
@Chocoflyer
02/03/08 17:10:58
71 posts

Godiva Chocolate room- AKA "shameless Valentines promotions"


Posted in: News & New Product Press (Read-Only)

Photo of Godiva's chocolate room- amazing- walls, artwork, candles- almost EVERYTHING is chocolate! http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22914565/displaymode/1176/rstry/22903236/from/ET/
Chocoflyer
@Chocoflyer
02/03/08 14:59:07
71 posts

Godiva Chocolate room- AKA "shameless Valentines promotions"


Posted in: News & New Product Press (Read-Only)

Heres a link to one of the more elaborate Valentines promos lately- by Godiva- http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22903236/from/ET/ certainly would be fun!
updated by @Chocoflyer: 12/13/24 12:16:07
Sera
@Sera
02/04/08 08:05:58
39 posts

Anyone heard of this Chocolatier/Chocolate?


Posted in: Tasting Notes

Yes, they do look very similar! I'm happy to see Ibarra put nutritional information for theirs, ha ha. ;)I haven't tried it yet, I'm pacing myself! I'll report back when I do. :)
Chocoflyer
@Chocoflyer
02/03/08 14:55:16
71 posts

Anyone heard of this Chocolatier/Chocolate?


Posted in: Tasting Notes

Sounds a lot like the Mexican type chocolate by IBARRA (red and yellow pkg) that comes in "hockey puck" size wafers, divided to cut like a pizza, that you add to warm milk over the stove, mix and melt all together - makes a killer hot chocolate! Its just cocoa mass, sugar, and cinnamon- very simple- but not meant for eating straight. Has not been conched at all- very grainy. I would like to try Don Puglisi- Did you try to make the hot cocoa?
Sera
@Sera
02/02/08 22:23:59
39 posts

Anyone heard of this Chocolatier/Chocolate?


Posted in: Tasting Notes

Thanks Clay! It sounds so interesting, can't wait to try it!
Clay Gordon
@Clay Gordon
02/02/08 21:53:11
1,689 posts

Anyone heard of this Chocolatier/Chocolate?


Posted in: Tasting Notes

Don Puglisi makes chocolate that is very similar to the Antica Dolceria Bonajuto bars. While I ran across Bonajuto in New York at Dean and Deluca, I first found the Don Puglisi at Bittersweet Cafe in San Francisco. I have the label somewhere in my collection. There is a forum thread on Bonajuto here . I ran the first paragraph on the "la cioccolata" page through translate.google.com and this is the result: The history of chocolate modican starts from distant places and times, from "failure" between Cortez and Montezuma, in 1519. It is said that the Aztec leader, as a sign of friendship, has offered a drink made up of cocoa beans coarsely chopped, with the addition of water, maize flour, chili, cinnamon and anise seeds. Drink welcome because little bitter. In fact, I first of Spaniards innovation was to add sugar cane.
Sera
@Sera
02/02/08 18:16:14
39 posts

Anyone heard of this Chocolatier/Chocolate?


Posted in: Tasting Notes

I found this bar at my local gourmet shop that's meant to be a "rustic" drinking chocolate. It's made by this Italian company called Don Puglisi. http://www.laboratoriodonpuglisi.it/dovesiamo.htm Anyone know of it?The directions on the bar say to cut off one of the sectioned blocks and melt in hot water or milk. The only ingredients are 45% cocoa mass and cane sugar.
updated by @Sera: 05/16/15 15:54:52
ChocoFiles
@ChocoFiles
04/24/08 20:33:23
251 posts

Inside Rating Systems


Posted in: Tasting Notes

Quote: "The problem with my system is that with such few choices, I want to differentiate between the three's, fours, etc. and I start adding .25, .5, or .75 to the score."Why not expand your ratings from 1-10? You're basically doing that anyway. In reality a 2.5 = 5 and a 4.5 = 9.Quote: "It's interesting to factor in price of the chocolate"Since 100g is a very common size for many bars I've been tracking the cost per 100g as a way for uniform comparison. In spite of the price varieties at different stores it seems to work well for me. I've also developed a "Value Index" which is a ratio of the Overall Rating I gave a bar to the price (times a weighting factor to get it on a 1-100 scale). That's helped me to figure out which chocolates are the best deal for the money. I've also been pleased with the results there too.
Clay Gordon
@Clay Gordon
04/24/08 18:43:56
1,689 posts

Inside Rating Systems


Posted in: Tasting Notes

To add a hyperlink, you need to highlight the text that you want to attach the link to, then click on the link icon, then type in the URL of the page you want to link to.
ChocoFiles
@ChocoFiles
04/24/08 16:00:07
251 posts

Inside Rating Systems


Posted in: Tasting Notes

Casey,Your thoughts are excellent and very thought provoking. Here's a small question how did you make the hyperlink in this sentence "to read the entire post go here." so that the word "here" is a hyperlink to your blog instead of the whole URL? I've tried clicking on the "Add hyperlink" icon, but I can't make it work. Can someone please tell me what I'm doing wrong?
Clay Gordon
@Clay Gordon
04/21/08 21:07:03
1,689 posts

Inside Rating Systems


Posted in: Tasting Notes

Theo B:I suggest you look at an online service such as Zoho Creator's database tool to both gather the data and present it. Ultimately, you will find it much more interesting to do so. If you like, I can help you with it and if you need it hosted someplace I may be able to help you there, too.You can use a service like tinyurl or snipurl to generate short URLs to take the place of long ones.
ChocoFiles
@ChocoFiles
04/21/08 17:37:10
251 posts

Inside Rating Systems


Posted in: Tasting Notes

P.S.- How do you make a long url just appear as a hyperlink so that people just click on a word to get there without seeing the whole address?
ChocoFiles
@ChocoFiles
04/21/08 17:34:55
251 posts

Inside Rating Systems


Posted in: Tasting Notes

This is a fascinating and informative discussion. I'm new to this, so I'm trying to learn all I can. In the last 18 months I've tasted and rated about 175 bars. I developed a rating scale similar to Seventypercent, but I used different weighting. Then I only let that number be a guide and I give two ratings: Class (69 or less, 70-79, 80-89, 90-100, and various flavors) and Overall. These are very subjective and for my own benefit. Also, my palate has changed a great deal over the months, so I probably need to revisit the earlier ratings. I also grade on the curve so a really great chocolate pushes the other down. That happened when I tasted Amedei Chuao. Finally, I've also developed a Value Index that attempts to compare the Overall Rating to Price (and has a factor trying to get it on a 1-100 scale.) It works pretty well for me. Oh yeah, I also categorize price as the price per 100 g, so I often have to convert the price for bars of a size other than 100g. This allows for standard comparison, though. Sometimes it's still worth it to pay top dollar, though (to splurge on Amedei Chuao, for instance).I'm looking for a way to publish my results, so I've experimented with Google pages. Here's a really rough one that I'm experimenting with. Go to http://chocolatereviews.googlepages.com/3400phinney-bread%26chocolate I'd appreciate any feedback. I understand and appreciate the critiques of assigning numbers and I know the pitfalls. I agree with most of what's been said, but this is mainly for my own use and it works for me, so I guess that's enough reason for me to keep doing it.
Clay Gordon
@Clay Gordon
03/14/08 07:24:11
1,689 posts

Inside Rating Systems


Posted in: Tasting Notes

[QUOTED]Perhaps we need to add a category for consistency of quality across a brand.[END QUOTED]Gwen: This last point is very interesting to me. I have long maintained that one of the key differences between a "good" chocolatier and a "great" chocolatier is the ability to produce consistently high quality work consistently (and no, thats not redundant). One of the reasons I write about chocolate rather than making it is that production doesn't interest me. Once I have mastered something I want to move on - not replicate it thousands of times. I have great admiration for people who know that yesterday they made 1000 of these pieces and today they have to make 1000 more and tomorrow they have to make 5000 because it's coming up on a holiday.And each piece has to be its own individual perfect little work of art.The ability to do this day in and day out, week in and week out, year in and year out separates the "merely" good from the great. I consider these people to be chocolate experts, which is one reason I don't call myself one and prefer to call myself a chocolate critic.But I have still to figure out how to capture this concept of good/great in a rating system transparently in a way that instantly makes sense.If you take a look at the system I developed prior to starting work on chocophile.com, in the end I wanted to quickly get to the answer to this question, "What sort of value is this chocolate (or chocolatier) for the price being asked?" It can be used to cover the good/great question, but it's not always obvious to people that this is part of what the approach does. A rating has three components:Category -(price range: mass market premium, gourmet, super premium, prestige)Style -(Belgian-influenced, French-influenced, American, Nouvelle American (also referred to as Modern French))Rating -(bad, poor, ordinary, good, very good, superior, extraordinary)So a chocolate might be in the gourmet price category ($25-$40/lb retail), be Belgian-influenced (lots of factors go into this component), and be an "ordinary" value. What that means is that, given the price and the style of work, there's nothing special that stands out to recommend this piece or company.It's possible to assign a value to an individual bar or piece or specific products, so sometimes rating components have more than one value. It's also possible to assign a value to a company. So, a chocolatier who achieves a superior or extraordinary rating is one that meets my "great" criteria and is shorthand for saying that all of the work falls into that category. Similarly, a chocolatier might be "very good" overall, but have some superior pieces; the reason the chocolatier is not given a "superior" rating is that the work is of inconsistent quality. Most chocolatiers do some things better than others, so this kind of rating (where the producer gets a lower rating than some of the work) is most common.There are other ways to do this that I am considering that borrow heavily from restaurant ratings, which is to give an overall rating and then list specific pieces that stand out (recommended eating) and those that don't (not recommended).I spent a lot of time on this, with the intent of providing a guide to help people find pieces that are like chocolates they already know they like (sort of like, "I like Szechuan food, is this restaurant any good?).
Brendan
@Brendan
03/14/08 01:17:14
21 posts

Inside Rating Systems


Posted in: Tasting Notes

Lots of good points! I have *definitely* found that tasting the same chocolate at different times of day, in different surroundings, etc. affects the sense perceptions. Expectations also play a big part; I don't care much for the tasting notes I find on wrappers, and I usually get different results. Wybauw (in Fine Chocolates) makes the point that there is no such thing as an objective tasting. When your environment is positive, and your mood is good, you are more likely to enjoy something, and vice versa. In this sense, I think a chocolate's finish, snap, etc. are relevant, though secondary. Even package design. Intellectually they seem separate, but they definitely come into play in creating the impressions you get when you taste. One point I haven't seen brought up much (ok, I haven't exactly looked) is the thickness of a molded bar. Snapping a piece of a thin lil' Amedei bar and tasting it is a very different experience for me than..say, Dagoba? You know, one of the thicker, squatter bars.

The great subjectivity involved makes me shy away from a numerical rating system. Such a small snapshot can't convey much information, and complexity is the watchword of fine chocolate. I used to be more good/bad oriented, but as I worked with chocolate more my viewpoint changed. A chocolate I love to eat can be useless in a ganache. So is that a 5 or a 10? Some chocolate tastes like old leather, but that might be just what you want for a certain application. I prefer the flavor wheel that Felchlin uses (Chloe Doutre-Roussel has one like it in her book, as well). It gives you an idea what you're in for, and lets you decide for yourself how you feel about it. I guess I would add a section for Bland, though, to allow for the many chocolates that are.
Brady
@Brady
03/10/08 20:58:15
42 posts

Inside Rating Systems


Posted in: Tasting Notes

Hi CaseyI enjoyed reading your thoughts on rating chocolate. It's a topic that deserves more attention. Outside of Seventypercent's site, I haven't seen any detailed and comprehensive lists. I like their system but it is somewhat cumbersome for me to use and like you, the bottom line for me is the taste experience. Their system is weighted though, and well thought out. To me, their ratings have done alot to have chocolate labeled and appreciated like other fine products.I think rating, comparing and taking notes is a great way to learn about chocolate. More useful, it has helped me discover what I prefer. I don't have a great taste memory so I started my notes as a form of a shopping list. It has taken alot of chocolate but my note taking skills have improved. Regardless of the notes on flavor, texture, etc., I like to write my short overall opinion of the bar and then assign a number rating. I use a number scale of 1-5.5- my absolute favorites4- purchase frequently3- purchase on occasion2- eat for free or buy to retest1- probably won't eat this againThe problem with my system is that with such few choices, I want to differentiate between the three's, fours, etc. and I start adding .25, .5, or .75 to the score. This usually is the result of comparing chocolates back to back. They both still belong in the 3 category but I do want to make a note that I prefer one over the other. It gets even more confusing when my taste's change and I decide to go back and start changing scores. Overall, the notes and lists are just for me and they serve the purpose of learning and creating a shopping list.I've used this system for a couple years and have tried to come up with ways to improve it. I haven't come up with a way I like better but am open to suggestions. It's interesting to factor in price of the chocolate (I only take notes on solid unflavored bars) but also a bit complicating. Price changes from store to store and fluctuates greatly with the packaging. It's hard to make a direct comparison so I haven't implemented this.
Casey
@Casey
02/13/08 12:15:49
54 posts

Inside Rating Systems


Posted in: Tasting Notes

This is cross posted from my blog, The Chocolate Note. There is a limit on length of forum replies, to read the entire post go here .While I respect the opinions of other writers and enjoy reading their reviews and celebrate the diversity within the field, like everyone I do have my own opinion.Although I use numbers, I do not use a weighting system in the same way chocolate is rated at 70%, as I feel that chocolate and science do not go hand in hand, except at the level where high art meets high science, in other words -- alchemy. Alchemy is what creates chocolate -- mother natures hand and the hand of an artisan together create that which we know as chocolate. Therefore, a true rating system created by a great alchemist would be far more complex than the little charts used by 70%.Perhaps neither I nor any other chocolate writer are actually up to the task. So what we are dealing with is opinions. Chocolate is a complex and mysterious elixir created by nature, and one that science readily admits that it knows nearly nothing of. Therefore I submit that chocolate is too big to fit those narrow categories in the weighting system.I do not use texture, snap, or appearance in my evaluations of chocolate. In my view these things are fun and interesting, a part of the packaging if you will, but not an essential component of what chocolate truly is. It seems to me that, while I may enjoy a good snap or sheen as much as the next person, they are almost a separate art form or category which should be considered as something different than the basic question of what is the true quality of a chocolate.I also believe that the same person can taste the same chocolate at different times, and depending on what they are really in the mood for, and other subjective factors, and come up with different ratings. This is just part of the mystery that is chocolate, and that is a person. Neither are machines. So I dont think a linear and empirical rating will quite work.The process by which I rate chocolate is still evolving. For chocolate bars that are not flavored, at this time I am giving a rating to the aroma, one to the taste experience, and another to the finish. I then take an average of the three. Right now I am playing with the idea of possibly giving each rating individually instead of taking the average of the three, but am at the moment still combining and giving one overall rating to each chocolate. For filled chocolates and flavored bars, I come up with one rating based on the overall experience.Perhaps it is simply a matter of my own personal right/left brain balance that I choose to use numbers, yet with a more subjective system. I say subjective in quotes because really, isnt it all subjective, isnt that what we are here for?Yet a word system might just be a little too subjective for my blood. I feel that whereas a very good could be so differently interpreted, an 8.6 is pretty clear. However, with respect to all kinds of minds, here is a rough translation:9-10 supreme/excellent/ superb/fantastic/heavenly/sublime8-9 very good/excellent7-8 good/very good6-7 pretty good/good5-6 okay/pretty good4-5 just there/okay/mediocre3-4 pretty bad/bad2-3 awful1-2 really disgusting0-1 inflicting injury/dangerous/poisonIf I am using numbers but not strictly using math to come up with them, then why do I use decimals? Why do I say 8.6 instead of just jumping from 8 to 9? Well, because sometimes chocolate is just better than an 8, but not really quite a 9. And I guess because my mind likes math, 8.5 is not good enough either, no, its closer to 9 than that, but not much.
Clay Gordon
@Clay Gordon
02/02/08 10:09:05
1,689 posts

Inside Rating Systems


Posted in: Tasting Notes

There are many different approaches to rating chocolate. The most common is to assign on a number on a 1-10 or 1-100 scale. One challenge with this is that everyone who uses a numerical rating system uses a different algorithm to arrive at the final rating.This forum thread is for members to discuss how they rate chocolate.I am indebted to Casey for prompting me to start this thread.:: Clay
updated by @Clay Gordon: 04/19/15 06:56:07
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